New rail depot wins approval

By The Post | Friday, February 03, 2012, 05:00

A CONTROVERSIAL rail depot at Stoke Gifford has been given approval – opening the door to electrification of the main line between Bristol and London.

Protesters outside the South Gloucestershire Council offices in Thornbury ahead of the public planning meeting over the rail depot at Stoke Gifford Picture: Jon Kent

Rail campaigners welcomed the decision, which they said would create jobs and help improve local rail services in the greater Bristol area. But angry residents who live near the 44-acre site claimed the new depot would ruin their lives.

South Gloucestershire councillors decided at a planning committee in Thornbury yesterday to give planning consent, with 11 votes in favour and one abstention, after a debate which lasted nearly two hours.

They imposed a raft of conditions in order to protect nearby residents from the impact of the new depot.

But afterwards Lesley Cox, one of the residents, said: "I am appalled because the evidence on which the debate was based was flawed.

Another resident, Heather Moseley, said: "We're disappointed but not surprised. The general feeling was that it was a done deal.

"We feel the residents' misgivings were dismissed and we were sacrificed in order to knock 15 minutes off the travel time between Bristol and London."

Transport campaigner Dave Redgewell said: "This is very good news for Bristol's economy.

"It's going to create jobs, protect existing railway employees and it will have the knock on effect of more local rail services.

"If this had not gone ahead, then it would have put back electrification of the main line for many years."

The rail depot, on a triangular patch of land near Parkway Station, will include a maintenance shed and sidings to park the new electric trains when they become operational in 2016/17. Work is expected to start later this summer, ready for testing trains by the middle of 2015.

The planning application was submitted by Hitachi Rail (Europe) which wants to run the electric trains on the Government-funded scheme, which will cost a total of £4.5 billion.

Andy Barr, Hitachi's head of maintenance, told councillors they had addressed the environmental issues to ensure that there would be "no noticeable impact" from the depot.

The sidings would have overhead wires to power the trains, which do not have to be uncoupled or shunted around. Some "biomode" trains do have diesel engines but these would only be switched on for testing purposes inside the maintenance shed.

Residents were worried about stray light keeping them awake at night but councillors were told that most of the lighting would be on waist-high posts because of the danger of dazzling train drivers on the nearby main line.

Ms Cox said South Gloucestershire Council had a reputation for allowing anything green to be concreted over and councillors had a duty to protect residents from industrial development near their homes.

She said: "If this site had not been available, then Hitachi would have had to go elsewhere.

"We feel this site happens to be cheap and convenient for them, but ruinous to us."

Planning officer Helen O'Connor spelt out to councillors how a raft of conditions would be imposed to lessen the impact of the depot.

She said experts were satisfied the new depot would not create noise above acceptable limits.

Cabinet councillor Brian Allinson, who is in charge of the council's transport and planning departments as well as representing Stoke Gifford ward, said he addressed the meeting wearing two hats.

He said he understood both sides because he appreciated the concerns of residents, yet saw the benefits of the new electric trains.

"I would urge the committee to take on board their concerns and if minded to approve, then toughen up some of the conditions," he said.

Keith Cranney (Con, Stoke Gifford) said when they first heard about the plans, they were very impressed but the residents thought the depot would be a blot on the landscape.

He said: "We want to see Hitachi go the extra mile to ensure the residents are protected, both now and in the future."

Among the extra conditions imposed were measures to be taken to prevent squeaky wheels on the tracks and a ban on other types of trains using the depot without further planning permission.

Mr Barr was asked if he would set up a liaison group so that Hitachi could meet with residents to discuss their concerns on a regular basis and he replied that it was his intention to do so.

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Comments

I was really excited at the prospect of the GW mainline getting electrified and Bristol's railways finally being dragged kicking and screaming into the late 20th century.

Now after reading Grahameight's informative posts it seems that we're getting the worst of both worlds - sort of slightly electric trains dragging around ruddy great diesel engines. And it looks like we'll all have to win the lottery to ride the blinking things.

Just bloomin' wonderful. And only in Bristol could it happen.

By Baldeeheed at 23:58 on 06/02/12
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@Betol

Ok agreed, with both realise we can't actually define numbers and true statistics on who is against or who is for this project. But over 760 people objected including online proposals.

I have to disagree with you that I would have been against this from the start. I went to the Public Consultations and saw the absolute shambles of the proposal in front of me. Thats what changed my mind. You had to be there to believe it, perhaps you were?

At least we agree on a few things, manufacture and what Grahameight has explained to us.
The link that Grahameight has provided is just one of hundreds of articles questioning the benefits of this proposed procurement.

I urge anyone who is commenting on the proposal to surf the net and find out what the other side to this story is.

By Stokeygee at 11:42 on 05/02/12
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@ Stokeygee.

If you are dead against the project right from the start it don't matter what the reports say. You will say no to it anyway regardless of facts. If the trains were to be built in this country then that would be fantastic and I agree that they should but they are not. At least the UK will get some of the work but in this day and age things don't work that way.

How do I know that the majority of Stoke Gifford are for it? Easy. By talking to people in the area where I live. At the last count the population of Stoke Gifford was 13560 so it works out that your petition has the backing of 5% of the population. Not a large number is it? The online protest were probaly the same people that signed the written petition.

I guess that the 5%, or as you put it 700 signitures, come from the roads that are in and around the perimeter of the new depot which is hardly surprising. Go deeper into Stoke Gifford and see what people say.

Interesting reading Grahameight's post though.

By Betol at 11:09 on 05/02/12
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After reading most of the comments on here and getting used to the brain dead people talking rubbish!!!!... Today i have to thank GRAHAMEIGHT for the true picture which he has taken much time to try and educate some of the younger generation!! and the town councillors that this train depot is just a white elephant!!!! You have now made them look like creatures from space who sit at computers looking for an argument and not doing any homework whatsoever!! .....You know your going to get a fight on yer hands now......they will be looking for information just to come back and prove you wrong.... very sad aliens!
Grahameight we need more people like you working for the south glos council then we could all live in a better world with a future for are young children....THANKS AGAIN.

By jackdaw6856 at 10:51 on 05/02/12
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Fatboy, I have never belonged to a union. Evidence? Have you read the industry journals? Attended the DfT seminars? Spoken to the engineering directors? I have. No professional railway person with any sort of engineering qualification wants these trains, and nobody in operations I've met does either. They are expensive lunacy.

Christian Wolmar is not my favourite transport journalist but he does speak sense here.

http://tinyurl.com/79rgscl

Modern Railways has qualified railway engineers such as Roger Ford and Porterbrook's Ian Walmsley writing for it. Vehemently for new electric trains, but utterly against this stupid civil servant inspired design. Hell even Hitachi didn't want to build it this way, but would have lost the contract if they did not adapt to the civil service doctrine of sticking diesels under 60% of the coaches.

ROSCOs, they are the companies that buy and lease new trains to the operators. There are three big ones and 3 smaller ones. Not once have they failed to have a problem getting one of these companies to take on the financing of a new fleet, and there have been thousands of new rail vehicles built in the last 15 years. The financiers and engineers in these organisations have said no to bi-mode IEP.
Adrian Shooter, railway engineer and until recently the MD of the UK's most successful railway company. Was featured on Panorama a couple of weeks ago for building new stations and lines at a far lower cost than had been achieved previously and overseen a 60% increase in passengers on his routes. Just retired he is now free to speak out against IEP, and he did, in a face to face confrontation with the person who led the team specifying it. One Stuart Baker of the DfT, now removed from the project.
This isn't a scare story, this is an absolute fact. You cannot change the laws of physics and the engine, raft, alternator assembly fuel tanks and exhaust systems will add 8-10 tons to the underframe of each equipped coach. Three on a five car set, four on an eight car. For 40% of the route mileage that is simply dead weight using more power to move around. Even Hitachi reckon this train will cost nearly 50% more in energy terms to run than trains in use today on the West and East Coast main lines, and those trains are longer than the IEP! The weight increases the fees paid to Network Rail, Track Access fees. Finally the cost of maintaining the things is massively more than it would be for a pure electric train as electrics need far less maintenance than a diesel, but an electro-diesel needs even more maintenance than a straight diesel, so you get the disbenefits with none of the benefits. That money will need to come from the taxpayer and the fare payer on a 25% / 75% split.
Dinner Parties, I work for the railway, no time to go to dinner parties usually, but I do extol the virtues of the railway whenever I can. I use it daily, work on it five days a week in a rolling stock engineering capacity, have also helped design some of the trains currently working in Scotland and the North East. We need effective, efficient electric trains on electrified routes, not a train specified by an team of non-experts. The Govt. has promised that will never happen again. But having spent £30m there are vested interests trying to keep the project going. If they succeed it will cost billions over the next 30 years. Because I and many others want a bright future for the railway we are trying to persuade Justine Greening to allow operators to choose the trains they want because we know not one wants anything to do with stupid little 5 coach trains toting 3 diesel engines. The result so far has been a change in the GW franchise wording allowing them to specify better solutions.

By Grahameight at 02:27 on 05/02/12
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